Charles Lewis, Vice President, Information Technology, Canada Life, discusses building technology to support positive outcomes for society, leading teams, and the hot topic of generative AI on CIO Leadership Live with Lee Rennick, Editor, CIO Canada.
00:00 100:00:04,640 --> 00:00:07,000Welcome to CIO Leadership Live Canada.200:00:07,040 --> 00:00:09,320I'm Lee Rennick, editor of CIO.com.300:00:09,600 --> 00:00:12,520I'm very pleased and excited to welcomeCharles Lewis, Vice400:00:12,520 --> 00:00:14,640President, Information Technology Canada Life.500:00:15,560 --> 00:00:17,320Charles,thanks so much for joining us today.600:00:17,320 --> 00:00:18,800Could you please introduce yourself700:00:18,800 --> 00:00:20,880and tell us a little bitabout your current role?800:00:21,760 --> 00:00:25,080Thanks very much, Lee, and thanksvery much for having me this afternoon.900:00:25,080 --> 00:00:26,280It's great to see you.1000:00:26,280 --> 00:00:29,800I am currently the VicePresident of Technology1100:00:29,800 --> 00:00:33,680for Canada Lifewith a particular focus on our IT1200:00:33,680 --> 00:00:35,720operations arm1300:00:35,880 --> 00:00:39,840as it relates to data centerand a lot of the traditional disciplines1400:00:39,880 --> 00:00:44,640that that comes with aroundcompute storage databases, the service1500:00:44,960 --> 00:00:49,560Canada Life Command Center,as well as network network operations,1600:00:49,560 --> 00:00:53,360the strategyalso moving into my portfolio over1700:00:53,360 --> 00:00:56,720the next little whilewill be our cloud operations piece1800:00:56,720 --> 00:01:01,080as we continue our journeyto move to public hyperscalers.1900:01:02,160 --> 00:01:04,120So a very large portfolio.2000:01:04,120 --> 00:01:05,680Thank you so much for sharing that2100:01:05,680 --> 00:01:08,040and I really appreciate youjoining us here, Charles.2200:01:08,720 --> 00:01:11,120We've created this series to support CIOsand senior2300:01:11,120 --> 00:01:13,800technology leaders in their leadershipand business journey.2400:01:14,200 --> 00:01:16,880So the first questionI ask, and I always ask everyone2500:01:16,880 --> 00:01:20,120this question, can you tell mea little bit about your own career path2600:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,120and provide some insightsor tips on that road path?2700:01:23,160 --> 00:01:25,400Are there any lessons learnedthat you could share?2800:01:26,160 --> 00:01:27,480Absolutely.2900:01:27,480 --> 00:01:31,960You know, the sort of keep it brief,I came up through the technology3000:01:31,960 --> 00:01:35,160ranks in a pretty traditional mannermany years.3100:01:35,760 --> 00:01:39,200Well, decades ago now.Began life as a software3200:01:39,200 --> 00:01:43,880developer and software engineerworking with in the telecommunications3300:01:43,880 --> 00:01:49,280area and was primarily on the softwaretrack through the traditional path3400:01:49,480 --> 00:01:54,040of developer, senior developerinto leadership in that vein.3500:01:54,400 --> 00:01:58,760I started to broaden outinto some of the affiliated disciplines,3600:01:58,760 --> 00:02:02,920such as software release managementand environment management.3700:02:03,160 --> 00:02:07,920As I began to take on larger portfoliosand got introduced3800:02:08,280 --> 00:02:10,320in a great way to the infrastructure world3900:02:10,320 --> 00:02:14,080as well, in about 2016,at that time I was with Telus Health4000:02:14,360 --> 00:02:17,960and have had infrastructureas part of my portfolio.4100:02:17,960 --> 00:02:19,480Ever since then.4200:02:19,480 --> 00:02:21,480The journey has been fantastic.4300:02:21,480 --> 00:02:26,640I've had great opportunity to learnso many different things from product4400:02:26,640 --> 00:02:32,400development to infrastructure management,architecture, user centered design.4500:02:32,920 --> 00:02:36,960I've been able to workwith so many great teams in that regard.4600:02:36,960 --> 00:02:42,520Have been very lucky to be partof planning and execution of migration4700:02:42,520 --> 00:02:46,880from on premise into public cloud,which is a journey a lot of large4800:02:46,880 --> 00:02:51,560organizations have gone throughor are going through will go through.4900:02:52,440 --> 00:02:56,240In the end,being able to really delve into my passion5000:02:56,240 --> 00:03:00,840for using technologyto be able to help others and5100:03:01,040 --> 00:03:05,960and make the world, if you will,a better place to be in some small regard.5200:03:05,960 --> 00:03:10,280As far as lessons learned along the way,I think there's always a couple of things.5300:03:10,280 --> 00:03:15,040As you grow older, you start to realizethose lessons a little bit more.5400:03:15,160 --> 00:03:18,760What sticks with meprimarily that I learned5500:03:19,200 --> 00:03:23,280and have been able to leverage overthe years is the way things have been done5600:03:23,280 --> 00:03:27,120before are not necessarily the waysthey're going to work in the future.5700:03:27,440 --> 00:03:31,480And like anyone probably pasta certain level of age,5800:03:31,880 --> 00:03:34,360I've had many experiences where5900:03:34,520 --> 00:03:37,240I've made mistakes by assuming that.6000:03:37,480 --> 00:03:39,520Approachesthat have been successful for me in6100:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,920the pastwould be successful in a new situation.6200:03:43,240 --> 00:03:46,600Sometimes you can implement thosewithout enough forethought, without enough6300:03:46,600 --> 00:03:52,080planning, and there can be some negativeconnotations and ramifications to that.6400:03:52,320 --> 00:03:56,600So that's one lessonthat has been has always stuck with me.6500:03:57,400 --> 00:04:00,200The other is open mind all the time.6600:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,960Great solutionsand great ideas can come from anywhere.6700:04:04,000 --> 00:04:07,240And one thing that I'm always keen on thatI've found6800:04:07,920 --> 00:04:10,560has helped me along the way,although it took a long time6900:04:10,560 --> 00:04:13,680to develop, is to be quite clearand quite transparent.7000:04:13,680 --> 00:04:17,600As you move forward and as you engageothers in things you're thinking7100:04:17,600 --> 00:04:21,000about, to seek their opinionsto make it better as well. Hmm.7200:04:21,440 --> 00:04:24,280Well, some great advice and some greatlessons learned along the way.7300:04:24,360 --> 00:04:26,320I totally hear that7400:04:26,320 --> 00:04:29,400you know, you've undertaken continuouslearning throughout your career.7500:04:29,760 --> 00:04:32,960You've understood and identified,obviously, that certain things7600:04:33,000 --> 00:04:35,240always work outthe way they have in the past.7700:04:35,240 --> 00:04:38,280So moving through thatand then the opportunity to network7800:04:38,280 --> 00:04:41,760with individuals, I mean, certainly we'rehearing that from so many leaders7900:04:41,760 --> 00:04:45,240in the tech sector just that networkingpiece is so important.8000:04:45,240 --> 00:04:49,120So I really appreciate yousharing that very much with us.8100:04:49,480 --> 00:04:53,040And you just referred to somethingthat we had our first discussion8200:04:53,080 --> 00:04:56,360gave me a little bit of goose bumpswhen we first talked, and I was so happy8300:04:56,360 --> 00:05:00,120that you said you would do this interview,because what you said to me8400:05:00,120 --> 00:05:03,600was that you're really passionateabout using technology8500:05:03,600 --> 00:05:07,320to enable outcomes that will lead,leave the world in a better place.8600:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,080So could you talk a little bitabout that, please?8700:05:10,080 --> 00:05:11,520Yeah, absolutely.8800:05:11,520 --> 00:05:15,600It's something I'm quite passionate aboutand I think for everyone8900:05:15,600 --> 00:05:19,400they approach technology or technologyimplementation and a different vein.9000:05:19,680 --> 00:05:23,080And even how people interpretdoing things for good9100:05:24,280 --> 00:05:26,560can belooked at in a myriad of different ways.9200:05:26,560 --> 00:05:30,800But for me, the real and continuedopportunity is always to use9300:05:31,800 --> 00:05:35,280software and other technologystacks and approaches9400:05:36,120 --> 00:05:40,960to be able to realize the true valueof interpretive human beings9500:05:41,120 --> 00:05:45,560and to remove some of the, you know,I hesitate to use the term like the9600:05:45,800 --> 00:05:49,960the grunt work or thethat the items that that weigh you down.9700:05:49,960 --> 00:05:53,000But to try to addresssome of those friction points9800:05:53,280 --> 00:05:57,720to allow us as humans to be able to really9900:05:57,720 --> 00:06:02,040use our brains on problems,start working on the interpretive things.10000:06:02,040 --> 00:06:02,760You know you can see10100:06:02,760 --> 00:06:06,800how this conversation leads downthe road of heavy automation, for example.10200:06:07,040 --> 00:06:10,680But more than that,especially with burgeoning data strategies10300:06:10,680 --> 00:06:14,360and the amount of datathat's out there, is a real opportunity10400:06:14,360 --> 00:06:17,640for any industry to be able to improve10500:06:17,760 --> 00:06:20,480the user experience of their end users.10600:06:20,760 --> 00:06:23,640And that can again come in many fashions.10700:06:23,840 --> 00:06:27,720I've been fortunate enough, both inmy previous role and in this current role,10800:06:28,480 --> 00:06:33,960to work with companies who are dedicatedto improving the wellness, be it health10900:06:33,960 --> 00:06:39,520or financial of Canadians.And to be able to contribute to that,11000:06:39,520 --> 00:06:43,360to be able to build technologyand support technology11100:06:43,560 --> 00:06:47,440that is meant to improvehealth of Canadian users,11200:06:47,520 --> 00:06:50,800to improve the financial well-beingand general wellness11300:06:50,800 --> 00:06:54,000of Canadians users,particularly here at Canada11400:06:54,000 --> 00:06:56,680Life as well as in my previous roleat Telus Health,11500:06:57,480 --> 00:07:00,520is just a fantastic opportunity.And those are the sorts of things11600:07:00,520 --> 00:07:04,440that I'm really passionate about,which is being able to take technology,11700:07:05,400 --> 00:07:08,120build technology and see an end result11800:07:08,760 --> 00:07:12,960where people are leading healthier,happier lives.11900:07:13,560 --> 00:07:16,000That is really inspiring.12000:07:16,000 --> 00:07:17,160And thank you for sharing that.12100:07:17,160 --> 00:07:20,680And, you know, definitely I see that.12200:07:21,000 --> 00:07:24,360Yeah, with the multiple of data we haveand the way we use it12300:07:24,360 --> 00:07:28,200and the way you work as an IT leaderto ensure that we can create benefits for,12400:07:28,640 --> 00:07:29,160as you say,12500:07:29,160 --> 00:07:33,280Canadians. That impacts on our overall,you know, health of our country, right?12600:07:33,280 --> 00:07:37,320Because if we're helping peoplehave better, more secure lives,12700:07:37,680 --> 00:07:40,760more healthy lives,being able to use that data for good, then12800:07:40,760 --> 00:07:45,240that that impacts on our overall structureof our country and and what12900:07:45,240 --> 00:07:49,280we have to use from a tax perspectiveto keep the country going and healthy.13000:07:49,280 --> 00:07:52,160So I really appreciate you sharing that.13100:07:52,160 --> 00:07:56,880And it gave me just some inspirationto talk a little bit about doing that.13200:07:56,880 --> 00:07:59,000Because when you're doing that,you're working with a13300:07:59,000 --> 00:08:02,760huge amount of teams in your organizationsand you're leading those teams.13400:08:02,760 --> 00:08:07,000So I wanted to ask you a little bitabout leadership and leadership roles13500:08:07,000 --> 00:08:10,280and really ensuring we're hearingnow that a lot of employees and13600:08:10,600 --> 00:08:11,960especially generations13700:08:13,480 --> 00:08:15,120want to have purpose.13800:08:15,120 --> 00:08:19,520So I'm wondering if you could talka little bit about how you lead13900:08:19,520 --> 00:08:24,800to ensure you're understanding,your teams, you know, in around things14000:08:24,800 --> 00:08:28,480like generational mix of employees,wellness and overall team planning,14100:08:28,800 --> 00:08:31,240Are there any tips you have thereor information you could share?14200:08:31,800 --> 00:08:33,880I can certainly share my own approaches.14300:08:33,880 --> 00:08:37,000I don't know if they'rewell thought out enough to be considered14400:08:37,000 --> 00:08:40,520tips for others to use.But you've hit the nail on the head.14500:08:41,080 --> 00:08:45,000Generally speaking, long goneare the days where people will simply work14600:08:45,920 --> 00:08:50,120in a role or in a jobthat they don't feel passionate about.14700:08:50,400 --> 00:08:53,880We all spend a great deal of timeand emotion14800:08:53,880 --> 00:08:58,000invested in our work.So we want to feel14900:08:58,160 --> 00:09:01,440that there is a tangible, measurable,good outcome to that.15000:09:01,440 --> 00:09:02,680That goes far beyond15100:09:03,720 --> 00:09:06,120just thenotion of traditional compensation.15200:09:06,720 --> 00:09:09,800Companies like Canada Life, for example,are dedicated15300:09:09,800 --> 00:09:13,080to serving our customer base,but not just serving them15400:09:13,080 --> 00:09:17,880by providing services, but providinginsights, by being able to help them15500:09:17,880 --> 00:09:23,360on their wellness journey, be it healthor financial to make their lives better.15600:09:23,640 --> 00:09:28,320And to do so, we needand have the engagement15700:09:28,520 --> 00:09:33,040of a huge number of employeesacross a breadth of products and services.15800:09:33,360 --> 00:09:38,560Canada Life is a massive companythat touches people in a myriad of ways.15900:09:39,240 --> 00:09:41,400And one of the great things about that is16000:09:41,600 --> 00:09:44,080you can start to form a cohesive picture16100:09:44,400 --> 00:09:48,560of, you know, Canadians as a wholeor your users as a whole16200:09:48,680 --> 00:09:51,840and understandhow you can support them between products,16300:09:52,640 --> 00:09:56,000between the piecesthat traditionally were isolated.16400:09:56,360 --> 00:09:59,640Now, the teamswho do that run the gamut from16500:10:00,160 --> 00:10:05,320new graduates who have joined us and co upstudents all the way to team members16600:10:05,320 --> 00:10:09,840and practitioners that have been with usfor beyond 30 years.16700:10:09,840 --> 00:10:12,600One of the things that has alwaysstruck me here at Canada, Life16800:10:13,040 --> 00:10:16,440well, always,I've only been here about eight months16900:10:17,360 --> 00:10:21,200is the willingness to come together,to look at things holistically17000:10:21,360 --> 00:10:25,080and do the right things,to arrive at the right solution17100:10:25,320 --> 00:10:27,920for our customersand for our stakeholders.17200:10:28,440 --> 00:10:33,200Leading in an environment like thatthat spans a multitude of generations,17300:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,800if you will, and different approaches.17400:10:36,640 --> 00:10:41,280What's really key there is listeningand more than just listening, but hearing17500:10:41,520 --> 00:10:43,960what people are sayingand what's important to them,17600:10:44,160 --> 00:10:48,840and giving them a forum to be ableto voice what is important to them.17700:10:49,120 --> 00:10:52,440And that's why I always harpand we may talk about it later as well.17800:10:52,440 --> 00:10:55,880Harp So much onthe concept of transparency.17900:10:56,160 --> 00:11:01,320We as technology leaders should be ableto form up a technology strategy18000:11:01,320 --> 00:11:06,000that directly tiesto a publicly known business strategy,18100:11:06,200 --> 00:11:09,520and our team membersshould be able to measure us against18200:11:09,920 --> 00:11:12,880measure our decisionsagainst that strategy.18300:11:14,280 --> 00:11:16,440When everyone is on board and pulling18400:11:16,440 --> 00:11:19,760in the same direction, you can accomplishall sorts of amazing things.18500:11:20,320 --> 00:11:21,400Well, it's very interesting.18600:11:21,400 --> 00:11:24,680Just before we hopped on this call,you said, How's your day going?18700:11:24,680 --> 00:11:28,120I said, we just had a presentationfrom our President about our business18800:11:28,120 --> 00:11:29,160objectives and goals.18900:11:29,160 --> 00:11:32,400And it was really, really engagingand amazing just to be able to learn that.19000:11:32,400 --> 00:11:35,680So when you talk about transparencythat certainly, you know,19100:11:35,680 --> 00:11:39,240I can relate to thatas an employee of an organization.19200:11:39,240 --> 00:11:43,200But I'm also hearing from youfrom a leadership standpoint,19300:11:43,200 --> 00:11:46,680like you're talking about allall of the work that you do for Canadians19400:11:46,680 --> 00:11:50,400to help with healthand financial stability and support.19500:11:50,680 --> 00:11:52,680And, you know,when I think of your employees19600:11:52,680 --> 00:11:53,760and your teams that are building it,19700:11:53,760 --> 00:11:56,400there are almost building itfor themselves as well, too.19800:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,520So you've got thisvery interesting product mix where you're19900:11:59,800 --> 00:12:00,920supporting Canadians,20000:12:00,920 --> 00:12:04,760but I'm sure many of your employersare building building initiatives20100:12:04,760 --> 00:12:09,400from a technology standpointthat are also helping them, you know?20200:12:09,400 --> 00:12:13,480Well, that's one of the amazing thingsabout working for an organization20300:12:13,480 --> 00:12:16,600like this and other organizationslike this is,20400:12:17,080 --> 00:12:19,880you know, the common expressionis eating your own dog food.20500:12:19,880 --> 00:12:24,280But our team members and practitioners,as well as our leadership teams,20600:12:24,280 --> 00:12:28,800we do use the very products and servicesthat we build for Canadians.20700:12:28,960 --> 00:12:31,800We're able to weigh in onwhether they meet our needs,20800:12:31,800 --> 00:12:35,040whether they're intuitive enough,whether they have the right user20900:12:35,040 --> 00:12:37,440experience,whether they have the right results.21000:12:38,240 --> 00:12:40,440So we know as we build,21100:12:40,560 --> 00:12:45,000as we promote them,as we move them out into the wild,21200:12:45,120 --> 00:12:48,000we know that we've done our utmostto ensure21300:12:48,000 --> 00:12:50,640that they're meeting the needsof our customers and stakeholders.21400:12:51,240 --> 00:12:51,720Amazing.21500:12:51,720 --> 00:12:54,000I want to have a whole other conversationabout those.21600:12:54,000 --> 00:12:55,320I find it very interesting.21700:12:55,320 --> 00:12:58,040We we didn't actually planto have that conversation21800:12:58,040 --> 00:13:01,320within these these questions,but it's it's very interesting.21900:13:01,320 --> 00:13:03,600I'd love to talk further about that.22000:13:03,600 --> 00:13:07,920But now I wanted to talk about an aska question around technology innovation.22100:13:07,920 --> 00:13:11,840Well, and specificallyAI talking to a lot of individuals22200:13:11,840 --> 00:13:14,920and tech leaders about this.22300:13:14,920 --> 00:13:19,080So could you just maybe talk a little bitabout this, Share your views on22400:13:19,360 --> 00:13:22,840how AI and the future of AI will impactbusiness?22500:13:23,400 --> 00:13:28,440I'd be happy to, and this is another onethat could be a full conversation22600:13:28,440 --> 00:13:30,880in and of itselfcould involve hundreds of people22700:13:31,440 --> 00:13:34,680because it's another onewhere there is a wide swath22800:13:34,680 --> 00:13:38,440of differing opinionsand more than just differing opinions.22900:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,680The notion of AI is one of those concepts23000:13:41,680 --> 00:13:45,000that tends to fracturepeople towards one extreme or the other.23100:13:45,000 --> 00:13:50,160Often, you know, at one camp,you often see folks that are validly23200:13:50,160 --> 00:13:54,560raising concerns about the impact aAI implement23300:13:54,920 --> 00:13:56,160without proper planning23400:13:56,160 --> 00:14:00,120and proper foresightmay have on things like the labor market23500:14:00,120 --> 00:14:04,720may have on things like informationprivacy may have on things like, you know,23600:14:04,800 --> 00:14:08,640what happensif if a self-driving car directed by AI23700:14:08,640 --> 00:14:10,720drives into someone,how do you prevent that?23800:14:10,720 --> 00:14:13,040What are the quality controls?23900:14:13,040 --> 00:14:16,680And then, of course, there's anotheryou know, the other extreme of the camp is24000:14:16,680 --> 00:14:19,320we've got to push forward with AI. The24100:14:19,680 --> 00:14:22,360you know, the sky'sthe limit on what can be accomplished24200:14:22,360 --> 00:14:26,000and we can push our innovationsthrough the roof to the next level.24300:14:26,280 --> 00:14:30,200I typically tend to feelthat the answer lies in the middle ground.24400:14:30,600 --> 00:14:34,000I am in the camp of peoplethat strongly believes24500:14:34,240 --> 00:14:39,280in the continued development of AI,but in an ethical and safe manner.24600:14:39,520 --> 00:14:42,360I believe in planning what it isyou want to do.24700:14:42,360 --> 00:14:44,000Understanding the use cases.24800:14:44,000 --> 00:14:48,560You're trying to drive and implementthose through an AI approach24900:14:48,560 --> 00:14:52,280that is both ethical and safe,and those have to be sort25000:14:52,280 --> 00:14:55,920of your primary concerns with the design phase.I do believe25100:14:56,040 --> 00:14:59,800AI has a great capabilityapplied across a swath of industries25200:15:00,680 --> 00:15:02,880to be able to help humanity25300:15:03,120 --> 00:15:07,080in everything from diagnostic helpfor physicians25400:15:07,320 --> 00:15:12,000to insights on health and financialwellness for customers of companies25500:15:12,000 --> 00:15:16,840like Canada, Life. I don't think it shouldalways be looked at25600:15:17,280 --> 00:15:22,000people tend to look at it as a replacementfor humans and or human thought25700:15:22,000 --> 00:15:26,600patterns. Whereas I tend to look at itas an extremely strong complement25800:15:27,040 --> 00:15:30,200to human thoughtpatterns and human decision making.25900:15:30,440 --> 00:15:32,960It's another toolthat we could use in our toolbox26000:15:33,400 --> 00:15:36,360to help us form the proper decisionsfor the best outcomes.26100:15:36,480 --> 00:15:36,840Yeah.26200:15:37,200 --> 00:15:39,280I appreciate that, those insights.26300:15:39,280 --> 00:15:43,560And yeah, definitely I've been, you know,having a few chats around the bringing26400:15:43,560 --> 00:15:46,560the design teams togetherthat are building the AI applications26500:15:46,560 --> 00:15:49,760that you're going to use, really testing,those are getting some great engineers in26600:15:50,160 --> 00:15:53,760and like you said, making sure that allthe checks and balances are in there26700:15:54,520 --> 00:15:57,480when you're going to implement itinto any of your programs26800:15:57,480 --> 00:16:00,120and products or services.So I appreciate that.26900:16:00,120 --> 00:16:00,920All right. So now27000:16:00,920 --> 00:16:04,480we're getting to the very last question,which is very interesting for me.27100:16:04,520 --> 00:16:07,920It's kind of I call it my lightninground question, but you get one answer.27200:16:08,800 --> 00:16:12,360And that question iswhat is the future of IT?27300:16:12,720 --> 00:16:15,320That's a great question and I wish I had27400:16:15,600 --> 00:16:18,040i wish I had thought about thatbeforehand.27500:16:18,960 --> 00:16:22,440The future of IT to me is really about27600:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,120what I'll call the frictionless response,27700:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,440so it's hard to quantifyexactly what the future of IT is.27800:16:29,440 --> 00:16:33,040The future of it is nowthe future of i.t was five years ago.27900:16:33,040 --> 00:16:35,240The future of ip is five years from now.28000:16:35,480 --> 00:16:38,560It's a constantly shifting discipline28100:16:39,200 --> 00:16:42,000that is driving towards28200:16:43,160 --> 00:16:44,800specific business outcomes.28300:16:44,800 --> 00:16:46,480And that's that's really the key.28400:16:46,480 --> 00:16:51,160As we move the IT landscape forward,we often make the mistake of implementing28500:16:51,400 --> 00:16:55,320different IT approachesfor the sake of different approaches.28600:16:55,560 --> 00:16:58,920And we really need to tie thoseto specific business outcomes28700:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,760that we're looking to achieve and tieit deeply to business strategy28800:17:02,760 --> 00:17:06,480for whatever organization it isyou happen to be part of.28900:17:06,760 --> 00:17:09,600There are of coursesome overarching technology advances.29000:17:09,600 --> 00:17:14,880I think everyone understands the valuein moving from on premise data centers29100:17:14,880 --> 00:17:19,760to public cloud in sort of specificindustries and environments.29200:17:20,040 --> 00:17:21,560Those are well understood.29300:17:21,560 --> 00:17:24,760There will always be changes like that.29400:17:24,760 --> 00:17:27,720There will always be a rapid paceof change.29500:17:27,720 --> 00:17:31,560In fact, the pace of change in technologyis increasing daily.29600:17:32,760 --> 00:17:34,360We used to be able to identify29700:17:34,360 --> 00:17:37,920a standard stackyou could use for ten years, 15 years.29800:17:38,160 --> 00:17:41,440You'd be lucky to identifya standard stack that would remain29900:17:41,440 --> 00:17:45,440the market leader for for morethan a couple of years at this point.30000:17:46,400 --> 00:17:48,480So you have to be willing to shift.30100:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,360But overall, to me, the future of IT,30200:17:53,280 --> 00:17:55,040I believe the way30300:17:55,040 --> 00:17:59,560this will start to develop itselfis we will in many cases30400:17:59,560 --> 00:18:04,440start to abs attract what we considerthe lowest level of IT to be today.30500:18:05,120 --> 00:18:10,120So just in the same way as we've gonethrough a journey of having people sort of30600:18:10,120 --> 00:18:14,760physically racking and cabling serversor spending,30700:18:15,320 --> 00:18:18,080spending a lot of time writing,30800:18:18,800 --> 00:18:23,560you know, writing COBOL, for example,you've seen programing languages30900:18:23,800 --> 00:18:27,720continue to develop into more abstractand abstract concepts that allow you31000:18:27,720 --> 00:18:31,400to get more donewith sort of full features of libraries.31100:18:31,640 --> 00:18:34,800IT as a whole will continue to movein that direction31200:18:35,480 --> 00:18:40,640from my viewpoint, which will againallow the focus of the individuals31300:18:40,640 --> 00:18:45,000working in those environmentsto not concern themselves31400:18:45,000 --> 00:18:48,720so much with the very timeconsuming baseline here,31500:18:48,840 --> 00:18:52,040but focus on higher value itemsfor their organization.31600:18:52,800 --> 00:18:53,760That is fantastic.31700:18:53,760 --> 00:18:55,200That's a whole other session as well31800:18:55,200 --> 00:18:58,000to. Thank you so much for joining ustoday, Charles.31900:18:58,680 --> 00:19:01,080I really appreciate it very much.32000:19:01,080 --> 00:19:04,240If you're interested in viewing this videoor others to support the senior tech32100:19:04,240 --> 00:19:08,000leader in their journey will include thisinterview and a link at cio.com/ca32200:19:08,040 --> 00:19:09,920Thanks again, Charles.